Author Topic: Going from Curlie to Strait Sighter (Read 571 times)

Mark Hanes · « **on:** April 05, 2011, 09:18:44 AM »

Last year I used the curlie 75% when nymphing. The other 25 percent was mostly dry dropper. What I learned is that is is deadly and versatile. The only weakness for me was I am terrible with the curlie in high water. At the NE regional I went with the strait sighter since in high water I did not see much use for the curlie. Well lets just say I sucked and dropped a lot of fish and rolled a lot of trout due to not being able to really get the feel that I used to have for strait line nymphing after using it for years. This past Sunday I went out and concentrated on using only the strait sighter to try to get my feel back. I also tried not to use too heavy of nymphs since I feel that makes it to easy. I did manage to catch 15 trout in the four hours I spent fishing but again I missed and rolled half that many. Lets face it if you are not in a competition frame of mind those fish don't bother you but for me I really wanted those fish. My question is if anyone else has encountered this problem and have they come up with a fix that worked for them? I will admit I am still a little rusty after the LONG LONG winter.

Any suggestions?

Dejon Hamann · « **Reply #1 on:** April 05, 2011, 05:06:01 PM »

I'm not sure there is any material fix other than "shaking off the rust."

I really see them as two tools for different situations now. Not one or the other exclusively. If I'm dredging with heavy nymphs, as we did in the winter quite often then it's a straight sighter. Or if I'm primarily casting a dry/dropper rig it's the straight. But everything else I'm still a curly fan.

John Killinger · « **Reply #2 on:** April 05, 2011, 08:33:06 PM »

I have no problem using the curly in high water, then again I didn't fish the Nationals. I just saw everyone else except a few get pissed. I did control one person who used a curly who caught 8 in one beat at McCoy. I still can detect strikes in high/fast water. I guess the drawback is you wind up doing alot more false sets in that scenario. What I really need to do is get a day when I know the fish are actively feeding, set up the straight sighter and try it out. I don't miss many fish fishing the curly, I really focus on it. With a straight sighter ,hich I used before going to the curly I hooked more fish which I never knew were until I tried the next cast.

Matt Rich · « **Reply #3 on:** June 02, 2011, 04:43:32 AM »

Hi Guys, First up - what a great site! Its really interesting to note the differences and similarities in our fishing styles and techniques! (Im from Cape Town, South Africa)

Just a few thoughts on the above:

When fishing 'curly' vs straight indicators/sighters I have found three things that help.
1) Grip: When using a curly you rely more on sight as apposed to feel with the straight - try running the flyline over your index finger PAD and then hold it there with your middle finger (line goes undermiddle finger)(fingers are next to each other not on top of each other). A lot of people hold the line either tight on the cork or run it into the crease on their fingers - the pad its the most sensitive area on the finger, we might as well use it. Also, running braid between the straight sighter and the flyline (which would still be in the reel) will help no end with feel. You can also wrap the braid around your index finger for added sensitivity. Tuck casts and being in contact with the fly at all times is obviously critical - not only as there may be a take as the flies are sinking but to know immediately when the flies hit the bottom so you can set the rod at that level.
2) It is very important to be comfortable - if your focus is even slightly on the fact that your arm/shoulder is tired from high sticking for extended periods, I find it reduces the sensitivity in you fingers. Light rods, light reels and changing angle of your shoulder/rod will all help this.
3) Hooks: You mentioned you were struggling to keep fish stuck - I'm not sure about the size of your fish or what hooks you are using, but thin gauge wire and barbless constructed hooks really help with penetration on light tippets. Most of our stream fishing is what you guys would call 'creeks' - small, thin water with fish averaging 14inch - 2 weight rods, 7x is the name of the game for us. I tie my flies, even the nymphs on dry fly hooks - Grip 11011bl (they also get marketed in Slovak as Maruto I think). Very thin gauge wire! If I feel what I think is a take, I will lift slightly (+-3inches) to feel if the tension increases and only then set the hook - this keeps the flies in the zone longer/more. The thin gauge wire helps here as you get better penetration on that initial lift - the fish can’t just flick its head and get rid of the fly as easily if it were a thicker gauge hook getting shallower penetration. An added bonus is that you can tie nymphs with thinner profiles which will sink faster. Just a side not though - with the thin gauge wire(or any longer shank hook for that matter), if you add tot heavy a bead, the fly becomes overly 'top heavy' which allows a lot of wiggle in the fly once it is in the fish's mouth when it starts shaking its head. You don’t need 3-3.5mm tungsten beads (faster water) as the thinner profiled flies will help it sink faster.

The major factor is just being in contact with the fly, REALLY BEING IN CONTACT! Not just thinking you are. At the end of the day it is just practice, like you said, you could just be rusty

Dejon Hamann · « **Reply #4 on:** June 02, 2011, 08:51:32 AM »

Welcome to the site Matt! Wealth of information in your first posts.

I've been gravitating to thinner wire hooks too of late for the reasons you listed. I was using grips at one time... had a few bend out on hot fish and moved away from them. Do you get the occasional bent hook and still figure the gain in penetration to be worth the risk?

Also, do you have a link to the 2wt rod you are using? Most anglers on this forum are using 3 and 4wts.

Matt Rich · « **Reply #5 on:** June 02, 2011, 06:29:22 PM »

Hi Dejon,
I don’t really have problems with the Grips, but then again I don’t usually use them on tippet diameters thicker than 6x, (This does not include the 14723bl – these I even use on stillwaters) You can generally spot any defects when they are in the vice. Also the 2-3# rods and boiled leaders usually protect both hook and tippet. When I step up to 4/5# rods then I'll start to use Knapeks and Dohkus.

As far as rods go check out: http://fly.greysfishing.com/en-gb/products/flyfishing-rods/single-handed/xf2-streamflex/
(10' 2# - 6 from the bottom

)

Dejon Hamann · « **Reply #6 on:** June 03, 2011, 09:05:10 AM »

Matt, the idea of having a, let's call it "very light" setup, with rod/hooks/leaders all matched to the purpose is an interesting prospect. A concept not at all foreign to traditional fly fishing markets for little creeks and brooks, but not spoken much of at least in north american competitive fly fishing.

My local 100% wild trout streams, where I've been spending the majority of my time lately, consist of feisty little fish where a 14" fish is a real trophy for the day, and an angler may fish a life time for an 18" fish. I'd say they are small to medium sized, but not tiny in comparison to some of the very small mountain brook trout streams I've fished in my lifetime.

I thought you would have pointed out the 9 or 10 foot 2 weight in that lineup. How does that short 6 footer treat you for some of the progressive nymphing techniques we use? It's the direction I was leaning toward attacking these smaller creeks... all though not quite that short.

Mark Hanes · « **Reply #7 on:** June 03, 2011, 09:37:45 AM »

Its a 10' rod D. you ok today man?

I really am starting to see an aplication for this fly hooks and a lighter rod for comps. The more i get into the the more I think i need a second job just to cover my fly gear purchases.

Dejon Hamann · « **Reply #8 on:** June 03, 2011, 09:52:07 AM »

oops. Haven't had enough coffee yet. Read that backwards, but refer to point "2" in my line thread.

Mark Hanes · « **Reply #9 on:** June 03, 2011, 10:30:43 AM »

yeah i know where you are going and that stream is a perfect test stream to work on the idea.

Anita Coulton · « **Reply #10 on:** June 06, 2011, 08:46:10 AM »

Matt,
Many thanks for your input! It's always nice to get a new perspective and get excited about trying something new. I'm really liking the light set up concept, and the thinner gauge hooks. It's yet another arrow in the quill that could make the difference. I generally fish a 10' 4wt for my Euro nymphing, but I see where lighter could be preferred, especially for wary wild fish.....

Thanks again for the post. Great to have you on the forum!

Mark Hanes · « **Reply #11 on:** June 06, 2011, 08:50:38 AM »

Played around with the lighter tippet along with thin gauge wire flies yesterday. As I expected it was effective and it allowed me to get some pertty light flies down in some quick water. I did notice some of the bigger fish were bending out the hooks but only a small hand full of the fish were heavy enough to do that.

Todd Oishi · « **Reply #12 on:** June 06, 2011, 01:19:16 PM »

Quote from: Matt Rich on June 02, 2011, 04:43:32 AM

Most of our stream fishing is what you guys would call 'creeks' - small, thin water with fish averaging 14inch - 2 weight rods, 7x is the name of the game for us.

Welcome to the site Matt! Are you friends with MC as well?

I look forward to hearing about the fisheries that you enjoy and the techniques that you're using in your part of the world...

P.S. I'm also a HUGE fan of using 2-weight fly rods, and do so for 95% of my nymphing and dry fly fishing - both competitively and recreationally.

Matt Rich · « **Reply #13 on:** June 06, 2011, 04:40:15 PM »

Hi Guys,

Yes, MC was in my team

He unfortunately is taking a bit of a break for competitive fly fishing - he is a real asset, an endless fountain of info and just a genuinely nice guy! He has taught me so much.

Good to hear the feedback r.e. the light rods and tippets. It's is surprising to hear that you are opening up hooks as opposed to breaking fish off. The setups mentioned, in the most part will prevent both, but if I do get it wrong on occasion, its generally a break off.

I might have been a bit overzealous about the average size of our fish though. On the thinner rivers, fish average around 10-12inches and on the lower reaches they are more around the 12-14inch mark. I would like to think that the average size of fish on a specific piece of water influenced rod/tippet/hook selection more, but as you say, budgets etc may not always allow it. That being said, I definitely find the 2# superior and bounce a lot less smaller fish.

I had a thought this morning that the use of shock gum between the fly line and leader may prevent bouncing small fish when I'm on the lower reaches using my 3#. Our river season has just ended unfortunately but I'll be giving it a bash next season for sure.

Rob Twombly · « **Reply #14 on:** June 28, 2011, 11:23:59 PM »

I switched from the curly to a straight sighter this year because its just easier and quicker to deal with if I am changing up rigs. I keep a small spool of red amnesia or chartruese mono in my vest and if I am changing rigs or tying a new one on I make less mistakes knot tying. I dont think the curly is that much of a magic bullet for me or anyone it doesnt fish any differently but may allow some to concentrate or see it better. Bottom line it comes down to adjusting the rig to suit the conditions, learning how the sighter reacts on a take and focusing on what you are doing.

Mark Hanes · « **Reply #15 on:** June 29, 2011, 09:37:27 AM »

i have been almost entirely straight sighter this year until the last few times out. In low water with small light nymphs. With French and Spanish long lining methods like this the curlie seems to be more effective.