hot spots

[Jim Frazier]

when fishing with hot spots what is the general consensus ? Do you feel that when fishing say a frenchie with a chart. grn collar that the collar draws the fish and the "actual" fly gets them to take or do the trout take on the idea that the grn mean caddis larvae ? same goes for a frenchie hot spot orange collar or bead hd with a orange bead , does the bead just draw attention or do you feel the fish take it for a egg ? Do you fish the chart. grn collar frenchie at caddis time (perhaps best time to use it ) and maybe the orange hot spot frenchie in the fall (perhaps the best time to use it ) just kinda thinking out loud here guys and wanted some opinions

[Bill Steudler]

I think you need to consult a trout about this!

[Jim Frazier]

ah come on willy a good guide is supposed to know what the trout are thinking !

[Dejon Hamann]

Yeah, that's a pretty esoteric one Frazier!

IMO, hot spots of the thread variety are triggers to put interest in a general insect form over the top... so to speak.  As opposed to egg colored beads which most certainly stand on their own whether in front of a fly pattern or not 

[Bill Steudler]

if i could do that i would be the best guide lol

nice word D haha

[Nick Naclerio]

I think we give trout much more credit than they deserve. Sure using flies that look exactly like food items helps and can sometimes be all that works, however there are flies out there that look completely unnatural and still catch fish. I think hot spots just grab the attention of the fish and more often than not cause a reaction strike. They fish sees the fly and doesn't have time to decide to eat it or not, it just does.

[Mark Ferringer]

I agree.  It's like moving from an exact replica of a sulphur, to a phesant tail, to a frenchie; we as fishermen have dumbed the fish down because we realized that an exact replica is unneeded.  Then we thought hhhmmm..., if I put a touch of fluorescent on it it might just help...  We realized that the fish see it simply as food while their world moves past them at 4 miles per hour.  A hotspot just gives that fly a little something more.  Example- I love Yuengling, but if I had to grab cans at 4 mph, I might grab the cans that were easiest, reguardless of brand, like a bright blue Busch, or a nice red Budweiser.  If I was a piggy and unpressured, I might grab a PBR! A nice bright label might make me want to grab one over the others.  Thank god they don't have hooks in them!    That was the sweetest analogy ever!

[Jim Frazier]

i agree nick but seems to me maybe green collars or beads would work well in stream with high populations of caddis larvae , and the orange beads maybe better in the fall of the year. D i am picking up what your throwing down here , but i am just having alot of fun with you guys ! on certain days the hot spot color means everything ? am i correct ? so it might not be a trigger ? if the color of the hot spot was in fact a trigger then the color of the hot spot triggered the trout into thinking it was something different given all other fly body parts were the same (frenchie for example ) wish i could back up a few molsons but i hope this makes sense !

[Nick Naclerio]

Its possible Jim thats for sure. If you have confidence in that fly that helps even more.

[Dejon Hamann]

Sounds to me like you should have eaten the blue pill Jim.

[Jim Frazier]

no blue pill needed here ! all i am saying is olive or chart grn caddis larvae and orange eggs are the 2 best flys !...lol

[John Dunn]

        Hay Dajon don't knock that blue pill   your turn coming .
            I'm thinking like Nick, I think it gets the fish attention.

                                                                     John D

[Jim Frazier]

dejon probably uses a 11 ft rod too and u know what they say about that ...lol

[Aaron Laing]

It's probably 11' 6" LOL

[Dejon Hamann]

No.  What do they say? 

dejon probably uses a 11 ft rod too and u know what they say about that ...lol

[Jim Frazier]

and a 3wt to boot ! 

[Bill Steudler]

I don't think it really even matters.  Technique is much more important than flies ever are.  I have caught a decent amount of fish on some pretty stupid flies.  I think fly selection is something that is used as a crutch for many anglers to use as an excuse to why they did not catch as many fish as they would have liked to that day.

[Randy Hanner Sr.]

Bill if I read the last few posts I believe they are saying D is overcompensating with the rod outside his waders as opposed to the size of his rod inside his waders.

[Bill Steudler]

hahaha, yeah I actually was replying to the question at hand and not Dejon's small P_N_S?  Would you like to buy a vowel?

[John Dunn]

             Well that does it , when I'm on Spring Creek and have to wiz I will be looking which one of you guys are hiding in the bushes.  Usually I am hiding flies of a different kind.

                                                                                  Best
                                                                                  John D

[Dejon Hamann]

Hey, I've got a little cabin fever too guys 

So, back to topic...

Personally, somewhere along the way over the last 10 months I really stopped using green/chart hot spots among others.  I guess it's that general move I've been on to simplify everything.  It used to be one of a half dozen hot spots I used, but now I really just use fl. fire orange.... when I'm looking for a hot spot. 

[Jim Frazier]

good info here guys . I guess i really wasn't sure if you fished the chart/grn hotspot when caddis larvae hot n heavy & orange in the fall for the egg look . I guess they are just all arround attractors and no ryhme or reason when to use em. just a typical cylce through the box with them being a general pick. ok thanks guys !!! dejon speaking of simplifying things , i once fished spring creek in state college with a friend of mine who is a guid in another state and he carried a fly box about the size of a 3x5 note card and that was drys and nymphs , needless to say he caught probably 20 fish that day. one other time we fished a light cahil hatch and i was blasting them on my light cahil parachute , he caught as many and probably more using a adams parachute . i said "what the hell u caught as many if not more than i did on a grey dubbed fly and a white fly is coming off " he said "jimmy color is last on the list pal" & "trout have a memory believe it or not , if they ate it once they will eat it again " i learned alot that day by golly !!!!

[Dejon Hamann]

Jim, the basis of your friend story and the 3x5 not card fly box is really a great example of a whole theory (so to speak) of fly fishing that i've been trying to evolve and write about over the last few years.  Hopefully a few of those articles hit home soon

The unfortunate, and i guess fortunate in many ways, truth of the matter is: we will never know!   There's just no way to get really concrete statistical evidence on the way trout react.  At least not until we can plug a usb port into a trout and read their responses based on stimuli. 

But that fact is one of the great things about this sport.  It's esoteric.  We get to stab and theories based on a little or a shit ton of worldly evidence and make large assertions.  Kind of like religion. 

So, in that vein.  I wonder if color REALLY  matters?  I think we may mistake a trout's reaction to luminosity as one to color.  I wish i had the balls to monotone all my comp patterns to find out! 

[Mark Ferringer]

So if we take away the vast array of colors that decorate our boxes, the legs off the nymphs, omit the tails because they don't see them anyways, and mute the colors, and just dub some fur on a hook with a flouro. orange hotspot, I guess all we need is a Walt's Worm!

[Dejon Hamann]

WW has become one of my favorties too withouth a doubt... and a lot more places than CPA... but don't group legs and dubbing into this color/luminosity theory